“With you or with you?”
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Ich Will heute Nacht bei Maria pennen….( at her place)
Ich will heute Nacht mit Maria pennen ( seems odd but i think it’s about as you said the activity, maybe in my place the penning thing is done:…I feel it’s directly refering to having sex)) right?
You wouldn’t really use “pennen” for sex, “schlafen mit” is the better pick there.
When you say that you can’t say “Maria will mit mir bleiben,” do you mean that this sentence is in all cases nonsense? Or is there some sense in which it could work?
I guess my confusion stems from that fact that “Maria wants to stay with me” is ambiguous in English – it could mean stay with me in a relationship, or continue to hang out with me in a bar, or stay overnight at my house, so I’m not sure which version you’re saying doesn’t work with “mit,” or whether you’re saying that none of them work with “mit.” Thank you!
I can’t think of a context where it sounds natural.
It’s not really nonsense, in that people would understand it, but it just sounds like a typical mistake a German learner would make and it sounds quite clunky.
As for the double meaning you mentioned… it’s the same in German.
This can be “at my place” or even “with me at a location” but also “in a partnership”.
At the core, there is a “locational component”, you’re talking about “WHERE” Maria wants to stay. So it’s not about sharing an activity.
Does that help?
Indeed it does – thanks.
EXCELLENT explantion!!! Thanks so much.
In the last example, if two men competed for Maria’s company, would you use “Komm bei mir?” — since the focus is on the person/’location’, not on the activity.
No, “kommen” is a directional verb, you need a destination of you are using it for a location.
bei can only answer “where at?”. For “where to” you need a different set of prepositions and in this case “.zu”
Fantastisch! Vielen Dank!
Thank you very much! So helpful. I have always struggled with this concept. I am definitely going to reread the mit and dabei articles.
This helps a lot!!!! You’ve done it again, Emanuel! :)
Camille
Nice, happy to hear that :)
Yes, I could probably manage a full membership if all the posts were this short.
Camille
Thank you . That has helped.
I’ll look at the longer version too to see about dabei.
cool article : )
Wir sage, “comst du mit?” Night bei.
Ja, das ist ja auch eine Aktion, kein Ort :).
Hi Emanuel!
How would you translate “with or without you”? Given that the two prepositions govern different cases, does it have to be “mit dir oder ohne dich”? Do you have to have two different pronouns? Can you get away with “mit oder ohne dich”? (Somehow I doubt it…)
Great question!!
In this case, the case of the preposition that’s closer to the noun/pronoun gets to rule, so that’s gonna be Accusative (from “ohne”)
And if you were to flip it around it would be Dative:
But the first version is definitely more idiomatic.
Vielen Dank!
And how about ‘She wants to stay with me (in a relationship)’? Is that also with ‘bei’?
Depends. If it’s a long term relationship that is like a family, with a common home, then “bei” would work, because there’s a locational component, but if it’s just a relationship where the lives are still separate, people would say “mit X zusammenbleiben”.
So I would likely say,
Ich moechte mit dir zu Hause bleiben.
or
Ich moechte bei dir bleiben.
Richtig, oder? Danke fuers teilen!
Technically yes, but you’d need a good context for the first version. It sounds like you’re specifically saying
I think if that’s really the message, then Germans would throw in a “mit dir zusammen”.
Back in German 007 they teach you early on, if you are into someone, pray for mit, and leave bei aside.
Wise advice!
Hallo,
Ich bleib’ beim Adventskalender to learn (and correct some typos in the process):
This means that Maria I stay at the bar (This means I stay at the bar)
Great article, it clarified this issue in just a few paragraphs. The other instance where I have problems with bei/mit is with the verb “helfen”… Hilfst du mir mit Deutsch lernen oder beim Deutsch Lernen?
Bis morgen!
As a rule of thumb, you could do a “action” vs “object” approach.
But with “helfen” people do use “mit” also for actions, and the other way around. It’s not really all that cemented :).
Sounds good! Prepositions are nearly as big a problem as separable verbs.
Same for me! I still every now and then have to check what preposition I need for an English verb.
This part of the learning journey really never ends.
Well, the English themselves don’t always know these things. For example that you “acquiesce in something”. Not “to”. (You “agree to something”, though…)
Americans are losing their prepositions. It’s really sad to me.
Camille
You must be English, John!
Collins dictionary (the first entry when you google this) says what I pasted below–so it seems you can use either TO or IN.
If you acquiesce in something, you agree to do what someone wants or to accept what they do even though you may not agree with it.
[formal]
Steve seemed to acquiesce in the decision. [V + in/to]
He has gradually acquiesced to the demands of the opposition. [V in/to n]
When her mother suggested that she stay, Alice willingly acquiesced. [VERB]
This is something that makes it even harder to learn because there are instances where you have to decide whether you’re learning British or American English (or another variant).
Yes, Anonmyous (unusual name…!) I’m British, and I taught English in France for 41 years. I had to accommodate American English (given that many of my students had lived in the US)… even when I felt it was totally WRONG.
: )
You’re doing a great job here, Emanuel. Where are you based?
I’m based in Berlin, but I travel regularly.
“anonymous” is the automatic user name that’s put in if the user doesn’t add one.
Similar to the bunny, but that is the pic that’s shown for all people who don’t enter an email, as these robot like thumbnails are based on the email address. Some trivia :)