“The Can of Innocence”
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I sometimes say “Dagegen/Dafür kann man nichts machen/tun” when in my head I want to say something like “There’s nothing you can do about it”. Whether it’s dagegen or dafür, or whether it’s machen or tun just kind of depends on what I feel makes sense. It’s good to know that it’s idiomatic to skip the machen/tun part as described in this article. Though, do you think it’s still valid to use my versions?
– Dafür kann ich nichts machen.
That means that there is nothing you can do FOR it. So there is a project and you’re asked if you can do something for it and you’re saying that you can’t.
– Dagegen kann ich nichts machen.
This means that there is nothing you can do AGAINST something.
Neither phrase captures the same sense as “ich kann nichts dafür./Dafür kann ich nichts.” because that is about blame or whose fault something is, not about doing something against it.
Does that help?
I guess this phrase conveys an idea that has not existed in my head before
Yeah, the closest English counterpart is definitely “Not my fault. Don’t blame me.”
Thanks. Having a German native speaker who can explain things well in English is such a blessing :)
Auf Französisch man sagt “je ne suis pour rien” , ähnlich, oder?
Ich kenne den Ausdruck nicht genau :)
Ich komme aus Frankreich und, als ich deinen Artikel gelesen habe, hatte ich nur eine Sache im Kopf: das sieht wirklich wie “(ne) rien y pouvoir” auf Französisch aus!
Wortwörtlich würde ich “ne rien y pouvoir” als “nichts daran/darüber können”… Mhmh, sieht sehr ähnlich, oder :)? Aber die Art und Weise, wie “nichts dafür können” und “ne rien y pouvoir” verwendet werden, sind auch für mich fast gleich.
Auf Französisch sagt man etwas so, um zu sagen, dass man keine Rolle haben kann, dass es nicht seine Schuld ist. Oder anders gesagt: dass man nichts dafür kann :)
Zum Beispiel (jetzt hoffe ich, dass ich “nichts können dafür” eigentlich gut verstanden habe…):
“Marie n’y peut rien, elle, que Tom soit en retard!”
“It’s not Marie’s fault that Tom is late!”
“Marie kann nichts dafür, dass Tom zu spät ist!”
Ja, das war für mich wirklich exakt dasselbe, in meinem Kopf, als ich französisch gelernt habe.
“Je n’y suis pour rien” oder “je n’y peux rien”, ja! Beide sind für mich sehr ähnlich wie “nichts dafür können”. Ich habe ein bisschen mehr darüber geschrieben, in meiner Antwort an Emanuel :)
There’s various back and forth about “can’t help [it],” so I’m not sure it’s worth jumping on an existing thread.
I do think this is the best default gloss, even if it doesn’t work in every single case. It may lean slightly more toward “not my problem” than “not my fault,” but in general, it really is sort of a blanket excuse. I’m not sure there’s a single example in the post where some version of “can’t help” wouldn’t work.
I think you miiiiight even be able to use “can’t help” in the DB example, though it would probably be a stretch. The only one I don’t think would work at all is the wer wofür wieviel kann one. But I think “can’t help” is functioning in all the above examples exactly as nichts dafür können does, distancing the speaker from blame/responsibility.
“Du hast die Lampe kaputt gemacht! Ich kahn nichts dafur! Timmy hat mich verfolgt! “
Yup, works!
Fantastic play on words, “Can of Innocence.” Idiomatic expressions are so much fun. No, I didn’t know that expressio .
Wow – more comments and questions here than I would have thought.
Deine schlechte Laune is nicht meine Schuld.
Ich kann nicht für deine schlechte Laune.
Gleich, ähnlich oder nicht (neither?)
Sehr sehr ähnlich.
You don’t see it used much in English, but there is a phrase, “there’s nothing for it.” Which basically means “not much to be done about it,” or one of my favorites, “it is what it is.”
I am here to thank y’all guys who paid extra for your membership so people like me can study. Long story short, I am a refugee from Ukraine who studies German to do my studies here. Hoping on getting into a bachelor engineering program. So thanks to y’all and to Emanuel again. It’s going to be really helpful along my long way :D
Good stuff Emanuel, very much enjoyed this.
I should think the equivalent in English would be “can’t do anything about.” It substitutes well in all your examples.
The issue I have with that is that it is often used in a context of “I am not able to do anything”, while “Ich kann nichts dafür” is about who’s fault it is.
Or from another angle “Can’t do anything about it” is forward looking, “Kann nichts dafür” is usually backward looking.
Hallo,
Some typos, I know, man kann nichts dafür ;)
“behind today’s door is really useful hidden gem” (behind today’s door is a really useful hidden gem)
“in teh kitchen” (in the kitchen)
“in teh comments” (in the comments)
This is an expression I knew!
But it’s always good to get some examples for context and a good explanation :))
Bis morgen!
Loveeeeeeeeeeeeeed it!!! Vielen Dank :D
Perhaps ‚I can’t do anything about…’ would be a close approximation
Ich kann nichts dafur; normally in English would be; I can’t help it….
Nah, that’s not really a match, I don’t think.
– Why is the server down??
– I can’t help it.
Is that idiomatic?
Yes, in that case it’s idiomatic in English to say “I can’t help that.”
But in the sense of “not my fault”? Because that’s what “Ich kann nichts dafür” means in that context. It’s not about being able to do something about it in this situation.
Yes, “can’t help it” means both “not my fault” and “can’t do anything about it.” At least to my American mind…
Maybe it’s something like “I can’t help it”? Like “Ich kann nichts dafür, ich bin so geboren.” “I can’t help it, I’m born that way”
Works sometimes, but not always. I think “It’s not my fault” is the better translation overall.
Overall, perhaps, but there is a distinct difference. “I can’t help it!” has the message of ineffectiveness/helplessness – that is, “I can’t do anything about it!” while “It’s not my fault” can be a much more neutral comment about causation. “It’s not my fault, but let’s see how we can fix it.” Tone of voice is everything when you say, “It’s not my fault,” but the German already tells you the speaker isn’t going to lift a finger to help.
(And guess what, the card game arrived while I was typing this – just in time for me to get whupped by my grandkids in Zürich next week. Woohoo!)
“but the German already tells you the speaker isn’t going to lift a finger to help.”
I feel like this is the common misunderstanding here in the comments and I probably should review my post (I won’t, no time :)), because this is NOT what “kann nichts dafür” is about.
I feel like maybe you’re all reading it as “doing something for it” in a sense of alleviating the situation, but that’s not what this is about. It’s about not being to blame. Like… I couldn’t have done anything differently. And this by extension can of course also mean that you can’t do anything moving forward but that’s not the core.
The origin of the wording could be interesting.. Americans thinking immediately of helping, or of the inability to have helped, whereas the German mindset is just ‘not my fault’.
My guess would be that the German phrasing used to be more like what people here seem to hear it as, but was shifted toward “excusing oneself” over time by usage.