“That this though”
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Hi ihr lieben,
German Advent Calendar 2024, day number 14. And today, I have a little usage nugget for you about:
How to say “this” and “that” in German
Most of you probably know that the German brother of this is dies-, with all the endings of course.
- “Welcher Geschirrspüler?”
“DIESER Geschirrspüler, Thomas!!” - “Which dishwasher?”
“THIS dishwasher, Thomas!!” - Practice pronunciation – click once to start recording and again to stop
But I think many of you are less certain when it comes to that. One option that you might come across online is jene-, again with the endings.
But the reality is… you won’t really need it anytime soon. It sounds VERY “remote”, like you really want to stress that whatever you’re referring to is nowhere near. The vibe is a bit like yonder, maybe.
But in practice, jene- just isn’t that common in both spoken and normal written German. And in many contexts it’s actually not even really idiomatic.
So how do we say that then in German?
Well, Germans tend to use just their normal definite articles – of course depending on gender and case. And people often throw in an extra da somewhere, to get this “pointing” vibe that that has.
- Das Einhorn hinter dem Baum da plant was.
- That unicorn behind that tree there is planning something.
- Practice pronunciation – click once to start recording and again to stop
- Der Spielplatz da ist neu, oder?
- That playground is new, isn’t it?
- Practice pronunciation – click once to start recording and again to stop
And in fact, Germans also do this when they want to express the vibe of this, where they kind of add a hier.
- Dieser Baum hier ist 100 Jahre alt and der da ist sogar älter.
- This tree (here) is 100 years old and that one (there) is even older.
- Practice pronunciation – click once to start recording and again to stop
You could also use the definite article instead of dieser, and just say der hier and der da, for example.
So, takeaway number one is that the vibe of this and especially that is often expressed by hier and da instead of the article itself.
But there’s another really important difference between German and English and that is that German simply doesn’t use these pointing-articles as much as English does.
English often uses that and those instead of the because that sounds more engaging, I guess.
For example, in fitness videos, English uses that and those ALL the time.
- flex those glutes, strengthen that core, can you feel those abs…
To my German brain, this is always a bit funny, because part of me goes like “What do you mean ‘those’. I only have one pair.”.
In German, we would just use the normal articles – the glutes and the core – and not using them causes my brain to think there are several that we need to distinguish between.
And also diese- is used way LESS than this is used in English.
German does use diese- as an article, as we’ve seen above.
- dieser Baum, dieses Einhorn, diese Bar….
- this tree, this unicorn, this bar…
What German DOESN’T do very much is using dies as a generic pronoun.
- This is what I mean.
- This is the problem.
- This can’t be right.
- ….
A super common construction in English, but in German, you just use das.
- Das ist, was ich meine.
- Das ist das Problem.
- Das kann nicht richtig sein.
- ….
We do have dies, but it would sound SUPER stiff. Like you’re writing a legal document or something.
Now you might be like “And the emphasis? What about the emphasis.”
Well… emphasis, shmemphasis. You can stress the das as much as you want, but that is the only way to do it.
This might actually be the most valuable takeaway from this all, so let me put it into a nice little Haiku:
Whenever you want
to use a generic “this”
use “das”.
Wow!
- Das ist kein Haiku.
- This/that is not a Haiku.
- Practice pronunciation – click once to start recording and again to stop
Exactly!
And bottom line… in a lot of instances where English tends to use this or that, German will stick with the normal der, die, das and maybe throw in a da or hier, if the pointing really matters.
And that’s it for today. Let me know in the comments, if you have any questions or thoughts.
Have a great day und wir sehen uns morgen!
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I just read this article about dies und das. Loved it. I learned a few things, even though I’m a native German. Gut gemacht, Emanuel — danke!
Ach nee, das wusste ich garnicht :D
Oh yea.. at the beginning when I read “ So how do we say that then in German?”.. I also asked myself that and was like “Wait.. I can’t think of it. Is my German that bad that I don’t even know what “That” is in German?”
Then I kept reading and I couldn’t agree more… Who needs it?
By the way, “[…] can you feel those abs… […] “What do you mean ‘those’. I only have one pair.”.” got me really laughing there! Thanks for the article :)
nice points
This was the best explanation of the German equivalent of “this and that” that I have ever read! What a great nugget, which was much more than a nugget. I am guilty of using “jene,” not knowing of its vibe. I needed to know how to say “this one and that one.” I feel I should have already known all that, but I did not. I have wondered so much about the use of “dies” as a pronoun. Thanks for such an informative Advent note,
Hi Emanuel, I read your blog since 1 year and my favorite absolutes Blog Entrys are the ones like today: you explaining something, that wouldn´t be said in text books nad only a Muttersprachler would “sense”/”ein Sprachgefühl haben”. Because I DID learn und USED a lot “dies” for “that” and know I felt I learned somethings that I would´t in my german lessons :) Thank you a lot for making that possible !!
Good. And super easy to understand
Are you okay, Emanuel?
There was no calendar post today (day 15), so I got a little concerned. I hope everything is well.
I’m travelling. Post is up but I am not updating the front page as regularly. Email newsletter is where it’s at.
I hate newsletters so I only check the site.
Glad to know all is well.
Great! Das war super
Ich habe gerade erst meine German Prefix Karte bekommen! Woo Hoo. Die Rückadresse kommt aus “Gerry Yasfbara” in California – for what its worth. Was für ein schönes Weihnachtsgeschenk von mir zu mir!
“Die Rückadresse kommt aus “Gerry Yasfbara” in California”
Uhm… please elaborate! Is that written on the package??
Sorry for my German. That was the return address that was printed on the package. From one of your earlier emails, I was expecting the cards to come from China but instead the return address shows that it came from California by that Gerry guy.
Might be their warehouse solution then. Maybe they ship in bulk to the west coast and then deliver out from there. Thanks for letting know, though!!
Now that we’ve been given permission not to try to translate every “that” or “this” as “jene” or “dies”, can you also free is from trying to turn every progressive tense (doing, making, etc-ing), into some weird “sein tun” or “sein am machen” construct?
Henceforth, you shall just use the normal present or past. And it shall be perfect. Go now, and speak.
You’ve mentioned yonder, but not yon. It’s a bit regional and rural. Yon cow needs a visit from the vet (or to be even more regional and rural, yon cow wants a visit from the vet).
I actually didn’t know about “yon” but from your example it seems it’s the exact brother of “jene-“
Sehr cool! 50 years ago we were taught to use “jene” but I have to admit that the only place I encountered it was in “Der Lindenbaum.”
This clears up quite a few questions I had on this subject. Thanks, Emanuel
Regarding the fitness thing — it seems a bit over the top to me also. It feels like this is how drill sergeants would drill, which I guess someone in charge of a large class might wish to sound. Someone loud. I could imagine a fire chief directing his firefighters in this manner, or a construction boss.
Right – spot on. So the ‘tighten those glutes’ aren’t directed to just one person’s glutes, but a platoon or yoga class’s worth of glutes. Good call!
Well, but they do say “squeeze that biceps” and not “those bicepses”, so I think those Youtubers, in their mind, address one person directly. The origin can of course be the military or whatever, but I think it has come into its own.
Das hier ist eine gute Diskussion und klärt einige meiner Verwirrungen bei der Übersetzung auf.
Das hier ist super. Das was du da geschrieben hast ist super. Die Idee da ist ganz einfach. Wie das Lied da, kenst du dieses, das die Fantastische Vier singt: Ist das die da? Oder die da? Nein Freitags ist sie nie da! Die da, die da, die da…
Hahaha, super gemacht.
“kenst du dieses”
Das sollte auch “das” sein.
Hallo!
Only one typo:
“A the vibe is a bit like yonder, maybe” (The vibe is a bit like yonder, maybe)
Thanks, this was a very informative article, basic as the theme may sound, it’s explained a lot, sometimes we learners fail to understand these little things :))
Bis morgen!
Very useful. I’ve definitely seen ‘das’ used a lot in these kinds of situations. So my takeaway is try to use articles rather than ‘dies.’
And thinking about the fitness video thing, German seems to use ‘the’ articles a lot more than English? Like in English “I am combing my hair” but in German “Ich kamme mir die Haare.” Which of course still has sort of a possessive due to mir, but to my American ear sounds different. Maybe there’s a parallel or maybe just in my funny brain.
I told you not to use that there tractor: she’s broke. Use tother one yonder.
Tractor is a “she”? That’s so cute :).
There’s gold in them thar hills!
Also just also wanted to mention you see “dies” used online on reddit etc like the english “this” as a single word response to someone’s comment. And it seems as annoying in german as it does in english.
OMG, I hate that soooo much. I see it on Twitter all the time, from people of all ages, and I find it sooooo stupid. Either use “das” or “das hier”, which is how you talk, or just use “This” if that’s what you’re going for.
I fear it might catch on though.
lowkey dies :)
LOL!