Hello everyone,
and welcome back to part five of our series on Talking about Time in German.
So far, the series was slow and boring, but now, we”re getting to the more interesting stuff
And today, we’ll start with talking about
German Time Prepositions
Now, if you’re not sure what a preposition actually is, don’t worry. You’re not alone.
The long and short of it is that prepositions are words that relate entities in a sentences to each other.
“The table is on the cup”.
Here, the preposition tells us what the spatial relation is between the cup and the table… a very broken relationship. They should go to therapy.
But of course there are all kinds of domains besides space and one important one is time.
So time prepositions basically relate things in the time domain and today, we’ll look at the important German ones, see what they express and also go over a few really common mistakes English speakers tend to make.
If you want to know more about prepositions in general, I recommend my article about them. I’ll leave a link at the end of this article.
So, if you’re ready, let’s jump right in :)
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Hallo Emanuel, kurze Fragen über “vor”:
Es wurde im Artikel erklärt, dass “vor” nur für Zeiträume verwendet wird, e.g. “ich habe vor 7 Monaten angefangen, blabla zu blabla”
Allerdings kann ich auch sagen, soweit ich verstehe: “vor letzte Woche Montag (hat es geschneit),” oder “vor 17 Uhr (war’s windig).” Diese wirken auf mich, als ob Zeitpunkte bezeichnet werden.
1. Sind diese richtig formuliert?
2. Bedeuten die dasselbe wie “bis letzte Woche Montag,” “bis 17 Uhr/bis vor x Stdn,” oder gibt’s nen Unterschied im Tonfall bzw. bezüglich der grundsätzlichen Bedeutung?
Hey hey, ich glaube du beziehst dich auf den letzten Teil des Abschnitt ueber “vor”.
Das war ein bisschen ungluecklich formuliert und ich habe es jetzt rausgenommen.
Davor habe ich aber gesagt, dass “vor” fuer beides geht… points (names, nouns) und spans.
Es muss aber sein:
– Vor letzteR Woche…
Und das wuerde man vielleicht versuchen zu vermeiden, da es sehr start wie vorletzte Woche klingt, was ja was anderes bedeutet.
– bis 17 Uhr hat es geregnet
– vor 17 Uhr hat es geregnet
Der Sinn ist schon sehr aehnlich aber “bis” hat den Fokus auf dem Endmoment, waehrend der Satz mit “vor” nur eine zeitliche Platzierung ist.
– vor 17 Uhr hat es mal geregnet
Vielleicht hat es um 3 geregnet.
Hilft das?
Super danke schön!
Hi
Regarding the bitter
Bis in
Vs
In
controversy far down below in the comments:
I cannot tell when this conversation took place, but any consensus yet? Hate to see Germany divided again.
I would comment that in English saying
Starting in 3 weeks
makes perfect sense so “bis in” sounds good
In English saying that we will be in Berlin “in 3 wk” implies nothing about how long one will be there.
Separately
Can you say “ich Kommen vor 5 minuten “
Is that a time name?
(Admittedly sounds awkward in English. Better would be “within “ or “in less than”)
Regarding
An English example for this sis the pair since and for. For ONLY works with a span (a quantity) while since refers a point.
I have been here since yesterday. (since when?)
I have been here for 5 minutes. (for how long?)
Seems to me that “since yesterday” refers to a span, which would be readily apparent if you had been standing in the rain “since yesterday “
Well enough bother for one morning
Be well
Not sure which controversy you mean, I couldn’t find it searching for ‘bis in’. Could you help me out please? Next to the comment name, there’s a little icon. That lets you copy the direct link to the comment. If you could share that, that’d be great.
– bis in 3 Wochen
this means something will happen in 3 weeks that’ll end a steady ongoing process.
– Bis in 3 Wochen!
– See you in 3 weeks!
The process is waiting for the reunion and it’ll last until three weeks from now.
Can you say “ich Kommen vor 5 minuten “
Not really, no. It doesn’t answer “when?” by itself, at least not without contextaul fill in.
– When did that happen?
– 5 minutes.
This makes no sense.
What you’re trying to do I saying that you’ll be arriving before 5 minutes are up, correct?
– Ich komme innerhalb der naechsten 5 Minuten.
– Ich komme spaetestens in 5 Minuten.
The version with “vor” makes no sense and sounds like you tried past tense but got the conjugation wrong.
About the “since yesterday”:
Since + time indicates the moment something started. I guess you’re looking at it more from the perspective of the fact that it’s still ongoing, but the time indication is not about “when does the action take place” but rather “when does it start”.
– Standing in the rain for a day (the action takes place over the course of a day, we don’t know when it started)
– Standing in the rain since yesterday ( we know when it started and that it’s ongoing)
You’re right that you can answer “for how long?” with “since yesterday” but that doesn’t always work.
– I haven’t eaten since Monday.
if you read this in a diary without dates, you don’t know how many days without food the person was. You just know when the period started.
– I haven’t eaten in/for 5 days.
Here, you DO know the duration but maybe not what day it was when it started.
Does that help?
In your intro you make that common German mistake: ‘That’s because since a few days, I am STANDING at my new awesome high-adjustable desk’… English speakers would wince but it’s perfectly understandable . Idiomatically in English we’d say ‘For a few days now I have been standing’. Mistakes are also instructive, as you often demonstrate. Never change :)
Oh wow, lol. Yeah, that’s a really really typical “German English” mistake. I thought I was past that, but I guess not :D
A little question on time prepositions (hopefully a little answer???).
To talk about time periods with defined start and finish we use von…bis
zB von 2 (Uhr) bis 4 (Uhr), von Montag bis Freitag, usw.
But for calendar dates, we say: vom 2. Mai bis zum 8. Mai.
The vom is easy, because there’s an implied article in the dative now we are talking about ‘the second..’. By why does bis suddenly need a zu? Why not just bis dem achten Mai?
I’ve read some ‘explanations’ online about bis+zu being needed when the thing is being counted (up to 8 kilo) or something about indicating direction (bis zum Bahnhof) – but I don’t really understand those and I can’t see why that relates to calendar dates, when its not used for other times.
Actually – I think I understand the bis zu, in terms of zu indicating the end point, and bis indicating everything up to that point. So perhaps the question is why is it not von Montag bis zu Freitag?
I think the better approach to this “quirk/exception” is this:
– no “zu” without article
– you need “zu” if you have a direct article
That also applies for places.
– Der Zug fährt bis Berlin.
– Der Bus fährt bis zum Alexanderplatz. (the location)
– Der Bus fährt bis Alexanderplatz (the station name)
Why do we need a “zu” with the definite article? I have no explanation. That’s just what ended up being idiomatic but there’s no inherent logical reason why “bis” alone can’t work. It just doesn’t.
Hope that helps :)
Vielen Dank!
Hi Emanuel –
Mein Gehirn erwartete ein “seit” anstelle von “dass”. Könnte “seit” in diesem Satz verwendet werden? Wenn sie auf diese Weise verwendet werden, sind “dass” und “seit” austauschbar?
Es ist Jahre her, dass ich ein Reh im Hof gesehen habe.
Ciao
Interessante Frage!
Im Prinzip geht beides, “her, dass” und “her, seit”.
Der Unterschied ist ihre grammatische Rolle:
Praktisch macht das keinen Unterschied und Leute nehmen, was ihnen besser gefällt, und die Version mit “dass” ist wohl gängiger.
Hier ein Link mit ein bisschen mehr Erklärung (du musst unten die Links “expanden”.
Concerning the still pending 5.2 I just want to say, ‘Emanuel, you are the worst best teacher ever!.’ Still your the best, I really haven’t found anyone nearly as good at explaining these killer details. I find your lessons to be always very helpful. Thanks, bro
Haha, two things can be true at the same time :D!!
Seriously, thanks a lot for the great feedback!
That most be the worse explanation of prepositions lol
Why though?
In the examples about “bis”, we used “um” before the “Uhr”, for example
is this necessary or can we skip it, because the translators I am using are always skipping it? Is it like more formal or correct to use “um”, or it doesn’t matter?
Edit; I think I figured it out, Is it the “news speak”, “street speak” thing, where we either say
Es ist 8 Uhr
or
Es ist um 8 ?
so in the example above it would be (in “news speak”)
Yeah, you pretty much have it.
It’s either “Uhr” or “um” but not really together.
Colloquially, people also say “bis 10” just like that, but it’s better not to do that as a learner, because it might sound wrong if said with an accent :)
Vorgestern means 2 days ago (ich hoffe dass das richtig ist!)
Vor vorgestern means 3 days ago (really hope this one is correct too)
So, “vor 3 Tagen” (if 1 and 2 are correct), should it not be 4 days ago?
The first two things you said were totally correct.
But “vor 3 Tagen” is simply the same as “vorvorgestern” ;)
Thanks so much for the amazing mini series on time. I find the way you explain things so interesting and helpful!
Apologies if you covered this but I missed it, but how do you express a duration in past/present/future?
Eg
I normally work in London, but will be working in Munich *for 6 months* from February
I worked in a bank *for 6 months* when I was 20 years
I am not drinking beer *for 3 weeks*
Thank you!
Ade
Nice question.
– Ich arbeite ab Februar (für) 6 Monate in München. (I prefer with “für” but it also works without)
– Ich habe als ich 20 war (für) 6 Monate in einer Bank gearbeitet. (here, I clearly prefer the version without “für”.
– Ich trinke drei Wochen kein Bier.
Hope that helps :)!
Thanks fir the reply! I seem to recall learning
“Ich habe früher 6 Monate lang in München gearbeitet”
Does that eork?
Oh, yeah, forgot about that one. That’s also idiomatic.
ya an amazing article bro i learn german in my shcool
Awesome :). Keep it up and become fluent like a boss :)
heylopo
lopohey lopolopohey
Amazing article as usual but i have another approach though
Preposition can refer to a point in time or incident by mentioning it “vor,nach” /or using a spin “vor,in”
or can refer to a whole extension by mentioning it “für,in” / or pointing the both edges “zwichen,von…bis..”/ or pointing only one edge and leaving the other free “ab,bis,von” . seit is in the last group too considering that the other edge is now
my question why did not you give “nach” and “von” some attention ?
what is the difference between “von” and “ab”?
and can we use “nach” with a spin effectively?
i’ve just released that there is another episde of time preposition
Not really :)
Honestly, I forgot about “von” and “nach” when I first wrote it, then I thought including them would make it too long and then I never did a part two :).
“von” only work in the combo “von… bis” or in the phrasing “von X an”.
And yes, “nach” does work best with spans.
could you please give me a couple of examples for “her” as a preposition
Was meinst du mit “her” als Präposition? “her” ist eigentlich ein Adverb.
I meant what you actually wrote at the beginning of the next lesson (frankly i confused a bit reading that)
“I know… we still have to talk .. excuse me… (yaaaaaaaaaaawn)…. about von-bis, vor, nach, während and her but frankly… I don’t wan’t to… I just hate leftovers.”
Ah, I see. That’s imprecision on my part.
What I had in mind was the phrasing “her sein”…
– Mein Geburtstag ist 3 Monate her.
It’s technically not a preposition though, but more like an adverb.
You can find a couple of examples in my dictionary :)
https://yourdailygerman.com/meaning/her/her-sein/
“10 of 10 Questions answered correctly
You have reached 11 of 11 point(s), (100%)” lovely lovely lovely, bis zum nächsten Mal! (got to bed with all the encouraging words…)
Perfect.
Actually, you should try again today, and see how many are still there :)
Was geht denn, wenn man bis zu zur zum etwas sagt. Das order das gleiche habe ich vielmal gesehen
ich verstehe die Frage nicht. Auf Englisch vielleicht :)?
Obviously it is necessary to convert some German perfect constructions to English preterites (if we’re talking about colloquial German), so:
A) “On Monday, I have seen the pink, fluorescent elephant I had seen 2 days ago.”
becomes
B) “On Monday, I saw the pink, fluorescent elephant I had seen 2 days ago.”
B is a perfectly well formed English sentence in my native dialect of English at least. Do you think this is wrong or did I misunderstand something? (I understand the fact that it works in English proves nothing about whether it works in German, it’s just that you said it didn’t work in either.)
Never mind; it does sound wrong after I read it more. It should be “On Monday, I saw the pink, fluorescent elephant I had seen 2 days BEFORE.” (2 days before you saw it) or, for a completely different meaning, “On Monday, I saw the pink, fluorescent elephant I SAW 2 days ago.” (2 days before the conversation)
Actually, on second thought, I think “ago” is marginally allowable there colloquially for me, even if I would avoid writing it. It just involves a weird sort of acting like you’re in the period of time your talking about.
But what does the “ago” take as a reference? Monday, or the day of the utterance? Or is it up to the listener to decide? Danke :)
That’s was the main point of the examples. I think someone either here or on english.stackexchange said that my use of past perfect was wrong, so at first I thought you were referring to that.
But good it’s all clear now :)
Hi,
I’m a “German German teacher” in England, always looking for sites to recommend to my students.
Your blog is very helpful and students like your explanations.
Today I found an error in the Test yourself section:
How would you translate “I will be in Rome starting 3 weeks from now.”
1. Ich bin ab 3 Wochen in Rom.
2. Ich bin in 3 Wochen in Rom.
3. Ich bin ab in 3 Wochen in Rom.
4. Ich bin in ab 3 Wochen in Rom.
The 3rd option is marked as correct, but it’s wrong.
The 2 prepositions “ab in” can’t be used next to each other.
It would make sense to say “Ich bin ab Montag in 3 Wochen in Rom.” Which points to a monday 3 weeks in the future.
The 2nd option is the correct one.
Even better would be: Ich bin ab heute in 3 Wochen in Rom.
I hope that makes sense.
I second this.
Ich bin ab in 3 Wochen in Rom is not correct German.
Ich bin in 3 Wochen in Rom should suffice what you want to say.
Well, the semantic difference is that “in drei Wochen” by itself only means that I am there for the day. With “ab” it means that I’ll stay there.
But I’m on shaky ground with this one, it looks like.
Are you a native speaker, if I may ask?
I’m German :)
How did you end up here :)?
Any updates regarding this issue
Not really. To me, it doesn’t feel wrong and I have a hard time letting it go. I guess I should take it out to avoid confusion.
is there any example of Prepositions?
I don’t exactly understand the question. Could you please clarify?
Amazing explanation!!! Thank you SO much!!
Danke für das Feedback :). Freut mich sehr!!
Würde es richtig sein, wenn man sagt: ,, Ich habe am Montag wieder den pinken Elefanten gesehen, den ich am vorigen Samstag gesehen hatte.” ?
Ja, das ist richtig. Das “am” kann man (zumindest in der Umgangssprache) auch weglassen.